Should Perry's jersey hang in the rafters one day?

What does the Flock think?

Should or shouldn't Perry join the elite group of Jayhawks whose jerseys have been permanently placed in the hallowed rafters of Allen Fieldhouse?

Note: this is the kind of poll where it's perfectly fine to make your case (pro/con/unsure) in the replies. You might persuade another board member--who knows?

kuinfo.ku.edu/what-are-qualifications-ja...sey-retired-and-hung

Q: What are the qualifications that a Jayhawk basketball player must meet to have their jersey retired and hung in the rafters of Allen Fieldhouse?

A: According to the Kansas Men's Basketball Media guide: The original criteria for a retired jersey included KU players named college basketball player of the year, most valuable player of the NCAA Tournament or being named a four-time All-American. The list was expanded in 1997 to include Ray Evans, who holds the distinction of being an All-American in both football and basketball. The criteria was expanded prior to the 2002-03 season to include consensus first-team All-Americans, two-time first-team All-America selections and Academic All-American of the Year. In 2006 legendary KU radio man Max Falkenstien was added to the rafters to recognize his 60 years of brodcasting KU athletics. Having said all that, here is a Feb 2009 quote from Coach Self: "There is really not a criteria other than the greatest players that play here deserve to be considered for that."

For more information to use in considering your answer, check out the Wikipedia section on this, it is quite informative. And when you read it and start applying the information there to your decision making process, note that there are currently five additional players that meet the general guidelines for retiring their jerseys that are not presently in the rafters: "Brandon Rush, a two-time first team All-American selection, Cole Aldrich, the 2010 Academic All-American of the Year, Sherron Collins, a 2010 consensus first team All-American, Marcus Morris, the 2011 Big 12 Conference Player of the Year, and Thomas Robinson, a 2012 consensus first team All-American." Of these, only Robinson has yet to meet the unofficial "5 year wait" period that HCBS endorses.

Personally, based on the admittedly much looser criteria these days, I still would not put Perry in the rafters at this point. He has been a great player for KU, no doubt, but that is not enough to get him in the rafters. He has not been named Big 12 Conference Player of the Year, a consensus All-American, a two-time first team All-American selection, a NCAA Tournament Most Outstanding Player, or an Academic All-American of the Year to this point. So, short of his leading KU to an NCAA title this year and earning MOP, he would be a marginal member. Looking at who is up there today, and the 5 guys currently waiting in the wings to see if they are so honored, I could not put Perry up there ahead of any of them.

That's superb info, HE, as always. Thanks for putting that up to help people ponder the question.

I haven't voted yet myself--but wanted to pose it to the collective, since his 4-year career will come to a close after April 4th.*







* See what I did there?

Something else to consider - Perry wouldn't be the first superb scorer and rebounder whose jersey is not in the rafters.

Looking at Perry's climb up the scoring and rebounding tables, here are the people that are in KU's Top 25 in both tables. You will note that Mark Randall is the only one of them not to have his jersey hanging in the rafters. But every one of the others also has met one of the criteria noted in my previous post. I've placed Perry in the list based on where he is today, and note that he should finish his career ahead of Mark in both categories (he's already passed Mark in rebounds).

And yes, I used Top 25 because I wanted to emphasize for everyone just how incredible a player Wilt Chamberlain was in his mere 2 years at KU. If he had stayed for his senior year and continued to score (29.9 PPG) and rebound (18.3 RPG) at his KU career paces in each, he would rank 2nd in scoring behind Danny (only because Danny would have played 4 years instead of Wilt's 3) and first in rebounds in KU history -- in roughly half the games* that Danny played (147) in his career.

*1957 Wilt appeared in all 27 games.
1958 he appeared in 21 of 23 games.
My estimate used 24 games played for his senior year.
Without Wilt, KU still played in 25 games (finishing 11-14) in 1959, so 24 seemed a reasonable number to use for my estimate.

Wayne Simien's jersey is in the rafters.
But he was a consensus AA in 2005.

Bayhawk wrote: I love this topic! Great job . . .

Konza, I must say that I agree with Bayhawk, one of the top polls done in a good while! Thanks for starting it!

BTW, you'll note I pinned it.

If this team were to win the NC, even if Perry didn't get MOP, I'd personally think he would have an exceptionally strong case for that honor.

He would've done what Simien could not (help a team win a crown), and he would have given 4 exceptional years to KU as an exemplary student-athlete: something the likes of Pierce did not (as a 3-year player).

That's why I voted "not yet," because I believe the lack of post-season success during Perry's tenure is a blemish. A blemish that is certainly (and hopefully) correctable this year. But to obtain the rafters, I really feel his final team has to go all the way and cut down the nets. Just my gut feeling...

konza63 wrote: If this team were to win the NC, even if Perry didn't get MOP, I'd personally think he would have an exceptionally strong case for that honor.

He would've done what Simien could not (help a team win a crown), and he would have given 4 exceptional years to KU as an exemplary student-athlete: something the likes of Pierce did not (as a 3-year player).

That's why I voted "not yet," because I believe the lack of post-season success during Perry's tenure is a blemish. A blemish that is certainly (and hopefully) correctable this year. But to obtain the rafters, I really feel his final team has to go all the way and cut down the nets. Just my gut feeling...

Chapter and verse, K, chapter and verse. This team manages to go all the way, you know that Perry will be instrumental in their doing so. He ain't Danny, but who is? Even if he didn't get the Tournament MOP, I would want to see him in the rafters if they earn a ring. He really is the main threat, day in and day out, that the opponent has to counteract first, and that opens things up for his teammates to make a difference. Double him, and the others score. Don't double him, and best o' luck to ya, mate, ya just missed the Perry Express whirlin' thru the lane.

Good points on the 4-year deal. I'm certainly guilty of a little bias there. But if you take that to its extreme, what if some guy comes in and has a year like Manning's senior campaign, yet in his freshman year? In other words, just by way of example, what if Wiggins had come in, played absolute lights out, won POY, and helped lead KU to a NC--yet then left for the NBA? Would he have been qualified or disqualified from Rafters consideration?

At the end of the day, it's a bit subjective for those who make the call. And it seems like non-KU performance also back-feeds into the selection process. What I mean by that is, if Paul Pierce had gone on from KU to have a very "middling" career in the NBA (just sort of blended into the mass, like many other KU players who turned pro), would he be in the Rafters just based on his KU numbers and the success of his teams? (Relative, say, to a guy like Randall, who hasn't made the cut?) I'm not so sure...and this is coming from a guy who loved/loves Pierce.

Konza, based on the original, stricter criteria, both circumstances you note would warrant the rafters.
1. National POY
2. Paul was consensus AA his junior year.

IMO, 4 years really becomes an issue only when none of the other criteria are met.