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Rock Chalk Talk: Basketball
Anything pertaining to basketball: college, pro, HS, recruiting, TV coverage
Anything pertaining to basketball: college, pro, HS, recruiting, TV coverage
Who ain't dancing, ? picks, and the Men's NIT
2 years 8 months ago - 2 years 8 months ago #28708
by HawkErrant
"Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry and narrow-mindedness, and many of our people need it sorely on these accounts. Broad, wholesome, charitable views of men and things cannot be acquired by vegetating in one little corner of the earth all one's lifetime." - Mark Twain "Innocents Abroad"
In conference:
OU (#2 team on the First Four Out line; see below)
KState
WVU
OKSt
Re: the Pokes -- the bloody NCAA sanction is not fair to these kids; NCAA needs to come up with a different punishment. With an overall record of 15-15 they probably would not have made it anyway -- but they finished ahead of Iowa State in the Big 12, the toughest conference in Division 1, so no way to know for sure.
Looking at former KANSAS conference foes, we have...
My Aggies (tough break.
Last team on the "First Four Out" line.)
Colorado
Nebraska
...and one other. If only could remember the name, it somehow escapes me right now.
FIRST FOUR OUT (in order)
Dayton was literally on the doorstep, just fell short.
Richmond upsetting top-seeded Davidson in the Atlantic 10 championship game cost the Flyers their bid.
I would have liked for KANSAS to have had a rematch.
The Flyers are the first replacement team for any team that drops out before Game 1 Tuesday night.
NB: Once the games start on Tuesday, no replacements will be made if a team has to drop out for any reason.
The team the dropout would have played advances to the next round.
Oklahoma. I was hoping our old Big 8 foe would get in one last time before leaving for the SEC. Would have liked to see the Groves brothers go at it again. Just have to do it in the NIT (see below).
SMU Former KU assistant Tim Jankovich did a great job with the 23-8 Mustangs this year. Just not great enough, it seems. AAC 2nd place behind Houston and ahead of tourney entrant Memphis.
TAMU My Aggies relly needed to beat Tennessee to get in. Their stats just weren't good enough without that Golden Ticket win.
Based on the above it's hard to argue with Michigan and Memphis being in, even though the DPPI would have Michigan as an outlier.
I'd like to see the Committee release their analysis of why at-large teams got in and explaining their methodology.
For example, looking at the above #s it seems pretty clear that the First Four Out order should be
OU
SMU
Dayton
Texas A&M
And with 32 Conference Golden Ticket bids leaving 36 At-Large bids for the Committee to select, were there really 36 At-Large teams that had better numbers than SMU and OU?
And CBS' Jerry Palm makes a case for my Aggies (and for puke being ranked too high).
From what I can tell there was only one real bubble buster, i.e., a team that did not win their conference regular season title but won their tournament, resulting in their conference having an extra team in the Dance that would not otherwise be in.
A10 - Richmond won, Davidson made it in at-large. Davidson would have been only A10 team if they had won their tournament.
One could argue that Virginia Tech might be considered a bubble buster, the 7th place team in the ACC regular season standings making it in and 5th place Wake Forest and 6th place Virginia not making it in. But despite the finish in the regular season, Virginia Tech has very good ratings in every model, all in the mid-20s except for the DPPI's 32. Those rankings -- significantly better than any of the First Four Out, and combined with winning 23 games -- probably had them in as an at-large anyway.
Ah, well...
Here are the NIT teams and a link to the NIT bracket .
Dayton, OU, SMU and Texas A&M all made it as 1 seeds.
Upper Left Bracket
No. 1 Dayton vs. Toledo | Wednesday, March 16, 7 p.m. on ESPN+
No. 2 Xavier vs. Cleveland State | Tuesday, March 15, 9 p.m. on ESPNU
No. 3 Florida vs. Iona | Wednesday, March 16, 9 p.m. on ESPN2
No. 4 Vanderbilt vs. Belmont | Tuesday, March 15, 7 p.m. on ESPN2
Lower Left Bracket
No. 1 Oklahoma vs. Missouri State | Tuesday, March 15, 7 p.m. on ESPN
No. 2 North Texas vs. Texas State | Tuesday, March 15, 8 p.m. on ESPNU
No. 3 Mississippi State vs. Virginia | Wednesday, March 16, 7 p.m. on ESPN2
No. 4 Colorado vs. St. Bonaventure | Tuesday, March 15, 11 p.m. on ESPN2
Upper Right Bracket
No. 1 SMU vs. Nicholls | Wednesday, March 16, 8 p.m. on ESPN+
No. 2 BYU vs. Long Beach State | Wednesday, March 16, 9 p.m. on ESPN+
No. 3 Saint Louis vs. Northern Iowa | Wednesday, March 16, 8 p.m. on ESPN+
No. 4 Washington State vs. Santa Clara | Tuesday, March 15, 11 p.m. on ESPNU
Lower Right Bracket
No. 1 Texas A&M vs. Alcorn State | Tuesday, March 15, 9 p.m. on ESPN2
No. 2 Wake Forest vs. Towson | Wednesday, March 16, 7 p.m. on ESPN+
No. 3 VCU vs. Princeton | Tuesday, March 15, 7 p.m. on ESPNU
No. 4 Utah State vs. Oregon | Tuesday, March 15, 9 p.m. on ESPN
OU (#2 team on the First Four Out line; see below)
KState
WVU
OKSt
Re: the Pokes -- the bloody NCAA sanction is not fair to these kids; NCAA needs to come up with a different punishment. With an overall record of 15-15 they probably would not have made it anyway -- but they finished ahead of Iowa State in the Big 12, the toughest conference in Division 1, so no way to know for sure.
Looking at former KANSAS conference foes, we have...
My Aggies (tough break.
Last team on the "First Four Out" line.)Colorado
Nebraska
...and one other. If only could remember the name, it somehow escapes me right now.
FIRST FOUR OUT (in order)
Dayton was literally on the doorstep, just fell short.
Richmond upsetting top-seeded Davidson in the Atlantic 10 championship game cost the Flyers their bid.
I would have liked for KANSAS to have had a rematch.
The Flyers are the first replacement team for any team that drops out before Game 1 Tuesday night.
NB: Once the games start on Tuesday, no replacements will be made if a team has to drop out for any reason.
The team the dropout would have played advances to the next round.
Oklahoma. I was hoping our old Big 8 foe would get in one last time before leaving for the SEC. Would have liked to see the Groves brothers go at it again. Just have to do it in the NIT (see below).
SMU Former KU assistant Tim Jankovich did a great job with the 23-8 Mustangs this year. Just not great enough, it seems. AAC 2nd place behind Houston and ahead of tourney entrant Memphis.
TAMU My Aggies relly needed to beat Tennessee to get in. Their stats just weren't good enough without that Golden Ticket win.
2022 Post Conference Tournament Model Ratings for Certain Div 1 MBKB Programs
PROGRAM DPPI KenPom Sagarin NET
Dayton 44 57 61 58
OU 43 30 34 39
SMU 37 54 40 45
Texas A&M 58 43 51 43
OKState 64 39 39 51
Michigan 62 33 24 34
Memphis 28 28 26 33
Virginia Tech 32 23 28 27Based on the above it's hard to argue with Michigan and Memphis being in, even though the DPPI would have Michigan as an outlier.
I'd like to see the Committee release their analysis of why at-large teams got in and explaining their methodology.
For example, looking at the above #s it seems pretty clear that the First Four Out order should be
OU
SMU
Dayton
Texas A&M
And with 32 Conference Golden Ticket bids leaving 36 At-Large bids for the Committee to select, were there really 36 At-Large teams that had better numbers than SMU and OU?
And CBS' Jerry Palm makes a case for my Aggies (and for puke being ranked too high).
From what I can tell there was only one real bubble buster, i.e., a team that did not win their conference regular season title but won their tournament, resulting in their conference having an extra team in the Dance that would not otherwise be in.
A10 - Richmond won, Davidson made it in at-large. Davidson would have been only A10 team if they had won their tournament.
One could argue that Virginia Tech might be considered a bubble buster, the 7th place team in the ACC regular season standings making it in and 5th place Wake Forest and 6th place Virginia not making it in. But despite the finish in the regular season, Virginia Tech has very good ratings in every model, all in the mid-20s except for the DPPI's 32. Those rankings -- significantly better than any of the First Four Out, and combined with winning 23 games -- probably had them in as an at-large anyway.
Ah, well...
Here are the NIT teams and a link to the NIT bracket .
Dayton, OU, SMU and Texas A&M all made it as 1 seeds.
Upper Left Bracket
No. 1 Dayton vs. Toledo | Wednesday, March 16, 7 p.m. on ESPN+
No. 2 Xavier vs. Cleveland State | Tuesday, March 15, 9 p.m. on ESPNU
No. 3 Florida vs. Iona | Wednesday, March 16, 9 p.m. on ESPN2
No. 4 Vanderbilt vs. Belmont | Tuesday, March 15, 7 p.m. on ESPN2
Lower Left Bracket
No. 1 Oklahoma vs. Missouri State | Tuesday, March 15, 7 p.m. on ESPN
No. 2 North Texas vs. Texas State | Tuesday, March 15, 8 p.m. on ESPNU
No. 3 Mississippi State vs. Virginia | Wednesday, March 16, 7 p.m. on ESPN2
No. 4 Colorado vs. St. Bonaventure | Tuesday, March 15, 11 p.m. on ESPN2
Upper Right Bracket
No. 1 SMU vs. Nicholls | Wednesday, March 16, 8 p.m. on ESPN+
No. 2 BYU vs. Long Beach State | Wednesday, March 16, 9 p.m. on ESPN+
No. 3 Saint Louis vs. Northern Iowa | Wednesday, March 16, 8 p.m. on ESPN+
No. 4 Washington State vs. Santa Clara | Tuesday, March 15, 11 p.m. on ESPNU
Lower Right Bracket
No. 1 Texas A&M vs. Alcorn State | Tuesday, March 15, 9 p.m. on ESPN2
No. 2 Wake Forest vs. Towson | Wednesday, March 16, 7 p.m. on ESPN+
No. 3 VCU vs. Princeton | Tuesday, March 15, 7 p.m. on ESPNU
No. 4 Utah State vs. Oregon | Tuesday, March 15, 9 p.m. on ESPN
"Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry and narrow-mindedness, and many of our people need it sorely on these accounts. Broad, wholesome, charitable views of men and things cannot be acquired by vegetating in one little corner of the earth all one's lifetime." - Mark Twain "Innocents Abroad"
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