×
Rock Chalk Talk: Basketball
Anything pertaining to basketball: college, pro, HS, recruiting, TV coverage
Anything pertaining to basketball: college, pro, HS, recruiting, TV coverage
Thoroughly perplexed with lineup
- AZhawk87
-
Topic Author
- Offline
- Platinum Member
-
Less
More
- Posts: 574
- Thank you received: 685
8 years 10 months ago #2151
by AZhawk87
I give up. Can anyone explain Self's decisions for playing time? ZERO minutes for Bragg, Diallo, Svi and Mickelson?
If I'm confused and frustrated, so are the players.
Is there any explanation?
If I'm confused and frustrated, so are the players.
Is there any explanation?
Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.
Share this page:
- konza63
-
- Offline
- Moderator
-
- c'85 Towering toward the Blue
Less
More
- Posts: 2203
- Thank you received: 1280
8 years 10 months ago #2152
by konza63
“With kindest regards to Dr. Forrest C. Allen, the father of basketball coaching, from the father of the game.”
1936 inscription on the portrait of Dr. Naismith, displayed above Phog Allen's office desk at KU.
Based purely on Self's track record, I'd say it's this. He started with his veterans and, once they got down big, he became fearful of putting in the younger/less experienced guys.
If it were me, I'd DEFINITELY see what Mickelson could do against Lammert because he is KILLING us.
If it were me, I'd DEFINITELY see what Mickelson could do against Lammert because he is KILLING us.
“With kindest regards to Dr. Forrest C. Allen, the father of basketball coaching, from the father of the game.”
1936 inscription on the portrait of Dr. Naismith, displayed above Phog Allen's office desk at KU.
Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.
- porthawk
-
- Offline
- Platinum Member
-
Less
More
- Posts: 1775
- Thank you received: 1423
8 years 10 months ago #2153
by porthawk
I'm not trying to be harsh in critiquing Self's lineup choices, but I totally agree with you, AZ87. I just don't get it.
Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.
- AZhawk87
-
Topic Author
- Offline
- Platinum Member
-
Less
More
- Posts: 574
- Thank you received: 685
8 years 10 months ago #2163
by AZhawk87
I'll be harsh. I've played and coached for 30+ years. Not at the D-1 level but long enough to know a coach can affect every player and the overall team by being inconsistent in terms of decisions and handing out playing time. Whatever is driving the playing time decisions is inconsistent at best and for sure is frustrating for everyone.
Svi plays meaningful minutes the last two games and makes noticeable progress. Zero minutes this game. I'll bet for sure he's steaming right now and not in a way that's going to make him more positive about the whole team. Just one of many examples today.
I reserve the right to revise this frustrated comment when I calm down a little.
Svi plays meaningful minutes the last two games and makes noticeable progress. Zero minutes this game. I'll bet for sure he's steaming right now and not in a way that's going to make him more positive about the whole team. Just one of many examples today.
I reserve the right to revise this frustrated comment when I calm down a little.
Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.
- Bayhawk
-
- Offline
- Platinum Member
-
Less
More
- Posts: 1981
- Thank you received: 871
8 years 10 months ago #2164
by Bayhawk
The end is nothing; the road is all.
-- Jules Michelet
You can calm down and still be correct,
RC
RC
The end is nothing; the road is all.
-- Jules Michelet
Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.
- AZhawk87
-
Topic Author
- Offline
- Platinum Member
-
Less
More
- Posts: 574
- Thank you received: 685
8 years 10 months ago #2172
by AZhawk87
Woohoo - we won.
I'm still shocked and disappointed at Self's decision making in terms of building a cohesive team going forward.
Svi - zero minutes
Diallo - zero minutes
Bragg - maybe five but all just giving Lucas or Traylor breathers. Never used as part of the game plan.
Greene - maybe three or four.
Mickelson - zero
There will be some pissed off players even after the win.
I'm still shocked and disappointed at Self's decision making in terms of building a cohesive team going forward.
Svi - zero minutes
Diallo - zero minutes
Bragg - maybe five but all just giving Lucas or Traylor breathers. Never used as part of the game plan.
Greene - maybe three or four.
Mickelson - zero
There will be some pissed off players even after the win.
Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.
- konza63
-
- Offline
- Moderator
-
- c'85 Towering toward the Blue
Less
More
- Posts: 2203
- Thank you received: 1280
8 years 10 months ago #2174
by konza63
“With kindest regards to Dr. Forrest C. Allen, the father of basketball coaching, from the father of the game.”
1936 inscription on the portrait of Dr. Naismith, displayed above Phog Allen's office desk at KU.
...in the absence of concrete validation would be that Self saw the team not pull out of its tailspin in Stillwater, when he used the younger, inexperienced guys more (save for Hunter). Then there was an upperclassmen-led team meeting in which they took the reins. Coach then decided to lean on them get us out of the funk. In doing so, he played with fire as we promptly found ourselves down 17-5...but to their credit, they did will the game their way and pulled out a big win at home.
That's all I've got. I hope the beat writers will ask Self about it (even if in a non-confrontational way), just for a sense of his thinking.
As for the players who didn't see much of the floor, it is what it is. Hopefully they look at the win and just keep striving. Keep working. Keep sawing wood. And hope they get a shot at some point.
Rock Chalk...
That's all I've got. I hope the beat writers will ask Self about it (even if in a non-confrontational way), just for a sense of his thinking.
As for the players who didn't see much of the floor, it is what it is. Hopefully they look at the win and just keep striving. Keep working. Keep sawing wood. And hope they get a shot at some point.
Rock Chalk...
“With kindest regards to Dr. Forrest C. Allen, the father of basketball coaching, from the father of the game.”
1936 inscription on the portrait of Dr. Naismith, displayed above Phog Allen's office desk at KU.
Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.
- konza63
-
- Offline
- Moderator
-
- c'85 Towering toward the Blue
Less
More
- Posts: 2203
- Thank you received: 1280
8 years 10 months ago - 8 years 10 months ago #2183
by konza63
“With kindest regards to Dr. Forrest C. Allen, the father of basketball coaching, from the father of the game.”
1936 inscription on the portrait of Dr. Naismith, displayed above Phog Allen's office desk at KU.
Here's Newell's post-game take:
cjonline.com/sports/hawkzone/2016-01-23/...n-shortened-rotation
And Haskins' take:
cjonline.com/sports/hawkzone/2016-01-23/...-boost-against-texas
What's interesting is that, if you read between the lines regarding what the upperclassmen told Self, it would appear they asked for going with Lucas (and Traylor) as the veterans alongside Ellis in the paint. And Newell indicates that this is the lineup Self most trusted to get a must-have win today. What followed from that was Diallo and Mickelson drawing a donut, and Bragg only getting 5 minutes.
I don't think that's a long-term recipe (especially postseason) for a deep run and high-level success. But given what transpired in recent days, and the results Self and the team on the floor got today (which he will no doubt draw lessons from), we might have to live with this as fans.
Final note: before the game today, Newell predicted KU would win, but it's fascinating who he chose as his "Hawk to Rock" (big player of the game):
It's time for Bill Self to jump quickly back onto the Hunter Mickelson bandwagon. Texas is greatly affected by shot-blockers and also can be hurt by good offensive rebounders and strong finishers at the rim. The KU senior checks all those boxes, so he has a potential big game ahead of him if Self decides to give him more playing time.
Interesting times...certainly interesting times...
cjonline.com/sports/hawkzone/2016-01-23/...n-shortened-rotation
And Haskins' take:
cjonline.com/sports/hawkzone/2016-01-23/...-boost-against-texas
What's interesting is that, if you read between the lines regarding what the upperclassmen told Self, it would appear they asked for going with Lucas (and Traylor) as the veterans alongside Ellis in the paint. And Newell indicates that this is the lineup Self most trusted to get a must-have win today. What followed from that was Diallo and Mickelson drawing a donut, and Bragg only getting 5 minutes.
I don't think that's a long-term recipe (especially postseason) for a deep run and high-level success. But given what transpired in recent days, and the results Self and the team on the floor got today (which he will no doubt draw lessons from), we might have to live with this as fans.
Final note: before the game today, Newell predicted KU would win, but it's fascinating who he chose as his "Hawk to Rock" (big player of the game):
It's time for Bill Self to jump quickly back onto the Hunter Mickelson bandwagon. Texas is greatly affected by shot-blockers and also can be hurt by good offensive rebounders and strong finishers at the rim. The KU senior checks all those boxes, so he has a potential big game ahead of him if Self decides to give him more playing time.
Interesting times...certainly interesting times...
“With kindest regards to Dr. Forrest C. Allen, the father of basketball coaching, from the father of the game.”
1936 inscription on the portrait of Dr. Naismith, displayed above Phog Allen's office desk at KU.
Last Edit: 8 years 10 months ago by konza63.
The following user(s) said Thank You: sasnak
Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.
- Hawknmo
-
- Offline
- Platinum Member
-
Less
More
- Posts: 346
- Thank you received: 158
8 years 10 months ago #2200
by Hawknmo
RKCKJHK!!!
Hunter has to feel he made a giant mistake. Put him on most Div 1 teams (including Arkansas) and he is getting significant minutes this year. For the life of me I cannot remember feeling as bad for any KU player. Please don't tell me "we don't know what happens in practice...blah blah blah.." He practices good enough to start obviously. He is getting jobbed by a coach who has an unexplainable attachment to an offensive zero. Im sorry. I am sure Lucas is a great kid, works hard and plays for the name on the front of the jersey. He can't hit the broad side of a barn from two feet away. "Well he got ten rebounds." I'm 5'10" with a phone book vertical. I could get 6 offensive rebounds too BECAUSE NO ONE IS GUARDING ME!!! Good teams know they don't have to guard him. To not give Hunter a shot today was just unexplainable.
I thought Bragg was infinitely better. He's an athlete who can shoot and rebound. Plus he pulls the 5 out of the paint because he can actually score which is good news for everyone. Did I mention I think playing Lucas is unexplainable? Bragg isn't a starter yet but exchange his minutes and Lucas' and I think we don't get down by double digits in the first half today.
Frustrating. Unbelievable. Exasperated.
RKCKJHK!!!
I thought Bragg was infinitely better. He's an athlete who can shoot and rebound. Plus he pulls the 5 out of the paint because he can actually score which is good news for everyone. Did I mention I think playing Lucas is unexplainable? Bragg isn't a starter yet but exchange his minutes and Lucas' and I think we don't get down by double digits in the first half today.
Frustrating. Unbelievable. Exasperated.
RKCKJHK!!!
RKCKJHK!!!
The following user(s) said Thank You: sasnak, DrJHawker
Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.