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Next year

  • DocHawk
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8 years 9 months ago #4436 by DocHawk
At the risk of looking ahead (at a 97% chance of a 12th Big 12 title, maybe that's a little bit justified) and wondering how K-State could be so tough with essentially a brand new team of players I've never hear of, I decided to see how likely they, and the other league teams, are to be a threat to #13.
Following is the number of seniors for each team who are starters or high level subs (not counting Forte at OSU and Long at ISU who might qualify for medical redshirts. I assume no one in the league leaves early.
KU 2 Ellis and Traylor
BU 3 Gathers, Medford, Prince
ISU 3 McKay, Nader, Niang (maybe Long)
KSU 2 Edwards, Hurt
OU 4 Hield, Spangler, Cousins, Walker
OSU 2 Newberry, Olivier (maybe Forte)
TCU 1 Abron
TU 5 Felix, Lammert, Ibeh, Holland, Ridley
TT 2 Williams, Gotcher
WV 2 Holton, Paige
To put the loses in perspective, here are the % points and rebounds lost
KU 23% of points and 24% of rebounds Both averaged 23.5%
BU 47% of points and 47% of rebounds Both averaged 47%
ISU 54% of points and 56% of rebounds Both averaged 55% (Long not included)
KSU 27% of points and 28% of rebounds Both averaged 27.5%
OU 64% of points and 54% of rebounds Both averaged 59%
OSU 28% of points and 22% of rebounds Both averaged 25% (Forte not included)
TCU 7% of points and 11% of rebounds Both averaged 9%
TU 34% of points and 42% of rebounds Both averaged 38% (Ridley not included)
TT 30% of points and 20% of rebounds Both averaged 25%
WV 29% of points and 28% of rebounds Both averaged 28.5%
Two things stand out. 1. We lose less than anybody (except TCU which had very little to lose) 2. There could be a major changing of the guard next year with perennial also rans like KSU, OSU and Texas Tech perhaps being our major threats along with West Virginia. Everything is changing except the Jayhawks being in position to win #13.
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8 years 9 months ago #4441 by CorpusJayhawk
Great stuff Doc. Welcome to nerd club. NIce analysis.

Don't worry about the mules, just load the wagon!!

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8 years 9 months ago #4446 by konza63
I second Corpus's post. Great stuff. Thanks for putting in the time on the comparative analysis.

“With kindest regards to Dr. Forrest C. Allen, the father of basketball coaching, from the father of the game.”

1936 inscription on the portrait of Dr. Naismith, displayed above Phog Allen's office desk at KU.

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8 years 9 months ago #4455 by hairyhawk
Very interesting because this KU team is so experienced I thought it would be worse than that.

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8 years 9 months ago - 8 years 9 months ago #4456 by HawkErrant
GRADUATING SENIORS 2015-16
F Perry Ellis (S)
G Evan Manning (W)
C Hunter Mickelson (S)
F Jamari Traylor (S)

NBA EARLY ENTRANTS 2016
None known yet; could include Diallo, Selden
(based on mock draft projections as of 2015-02-20, IMO both will end up telling us "I'll be back!")

RETURNING PLAYERS and AY2016-17 STATUS (Class, Scholarship or Walk-on)
SENIORS
F Brannen Greene (S)
F Landen Lucas* (S)
G Frank Mason III (S)
G Wayne Selden Jr. (S)
G Tyler Self* (W)

JUNIORS
F Dwight Coleby* (S) transfered from Ole Miss 2015, sitting out 2015-16, then tore ACL 2015-09-25**
G Devonté Graham (S)
G Sviatoslav Mykhailiuk (S)
F Clay Young* (W)

SOPHOMORES
G Lagerald Vick (S)
F Cheick Diallo (S)
F Carlton Bragg (S)

RECRUITS COMING IN
(the following uses Rivals info)
#27 Udoka Azubuike (C) 5 star
#117 Mitch Lightfoot (PF) 3 star

Plus KU is still in the mix for these recruits (at least 1 "ride" is available; more only if we incur other losses)
#1 Josh Jackson (SG) 5 star
#9 Rawle Alkins (SG) 5 star
#16 Marques Bolden (C) 5 star
#20 Jarrett Allen (F) 5 star
#112 Deshawn Corprew (SG) 4 star

PROJECTED STARTING LINEUP AT START OF SEASON
1 Mason SR
2 Graham JR
3 Selden SR
4 Bragg SO
5 Lucas SR

Losing Perry will hurt, but that's the nice thing about freshmen and sophomores -- they mature into sophomores and juniors!

"Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry and narrow-mindedness, and many of our people need it sorely on these accounts. Broad, wholesome, charitable views of men and things cannot be acquired by vegetating in one little corner of the earth all one's lifetime." - Mark Twain "Innocents Abroad"
Last Edit: 8 years 9 months ago by HawkErrant. Reason: reformat recruit portion
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8 years 9 months ago #4464 by NotOstertag
I was doing the same kind of thinking. Glad you guys put it all together. Right now, we have an EXCELLENT back court. I can't imagine that Frank and Devonte will regress going into next year. Selden, assuming he can rekindle his mojo, has a huge upper limit. Bragg should be ready, Lucas will be better, and we've got Diallo, Svi, Brannen, and a pile of talent ready to step up.

I'm going to bet that we're a preseason top 5 team with who we've got.

"When I was a freshman, I remember Coach Naismith telling us how important it was to play good defense." - Mitch Lightfoot

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8 years 9 months ago - 8 years 9 months ago #4469 by DocHawk
Experienced Lucas at 6' 10" and 240. Throw in Udoka Azubuike at 6' 11" and 270# and add 20# of muscle to Diallo and Bragg and we won't hurt in the front court for strength and athleticism either. By the way, Udoka will enroll at age 17. Maybe 1-2" to grow like Embiid?
Last Edit: 8 years 9 months ago by HawkErrant. Reason: correct names

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8 years 9 months ago #4470 by DocHawk
Forgot Dwight Coleby 6' 9" 240. No, we won't get pushed around next year.

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8 years 9 months ago #4471 by NotOstertag
Watching yesterday with a UCONN fan buddy, I remarked, "take a look at Bragg and Diallo. Now imagine them with 10-15 pounds of extra muscle slapped on them."

Hudy will have a field day with those guys. Imagine Diallo as a shot blocker, AND with some beef on him...scary.

"When I was a freshman, I remember Coach Naismith telling us how important it was to play good defense." - Mitch Lightfoot

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8 years 9 months ago #4479 by Senex68
If Selden comes back, our 'small' rotation would be Mason, Graham, Selden, Greene, Svi, Vick and possibly a freshman wing. That is an amazing group, one which will dominate the league and possibly the country. Vick, in my opinion, has huge upside, with his size and shooting ability. If Diallo returns, our bigs will be equally terrific. Lucas will start, but the rest of the group will rotate in and out, and there won't be anyone who will be able to handle our size or our depth. Add one more recruit, like Josh Jackson, and we'll be pre-season ranked #1.

"When you have a ruling class that doesn’t believe in — or even much like — the fundamental values of the nations it rules, things tend to work out poorly.”

Glenn Reynolds

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8 years 9 months ago - 8 years 9 months ago #4492 by konza63
I'd love for us to get Jackson (#1 Rivals, #3 ESPN), but if all those guys you cited returned, the question would be where would the kid slot?

Talk about a roster brimming with upside (and proven experience)!

If Jackson were assured Selden were leaving, you could almost see him moving in there, as a Wiggins-like big wing. (Jackson is 6'8, and generally "tagged" as a SF/wing) Supposedly he's very explosive around the rim, on both ends...but is still very much developing his perimeter game.

Given that, if Selden returned, we snare the kid, and Self decides he's better off playing the "4," the question is what happens between him and Bragg? And the broader question then becomes: would getting Jackson give us too many good players for too few slots?

I could almost hear Self's response as I typed that last question. "You can never have too much talent." As in, this is always a good problem to have.

But I'm just curious. Then again, it's all pure speculation, since we don't yet know who will stay and go. (The depth of our tourney run and the individual performances therein can still influence that question too, I submit--particularly for the likes of Selden)

“With kindest regards to Dr. Forrest C. Allen, the father of basketball coaching, from the father of the game.”

1936 inscription on the portrait of Dr. Naismith, displayed above Phog Allen's office desk at KU.
Last Edit: 8 years 9 months ago by konza63.

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8 years 9 months ago #4495 by Senex68
According the scouts I know, Selden is not ready for the NBA. His handles are not good enough, and his periodic 'fugues' don't impress people at all. Even with holes in his game, his inconsistent effort and/or focus really concern the NBA people. He's got the shot for the NBA, but he's still no better than a 2nd round pick, even with a relatively weak draft. Selden will go to the pre-draft workouts and combine, but unless he blows people away, he's going to come back next year, or possibly go to Europe. I don't know what his long term goals are, but if he wants the NBA more than the money, he'll come back for another run, and try to work out the flaws in his game and hopefully work his way into a 1st round pick. At worst, he goes to Europe next year, makes a ton of money, and MAYBE gets to fulfill his dream after a couple of years overseas.

"When you have a ruling class that doesn’t believe in — or even much like — the fundamental values of the nations it rules, things tend to work out poorly.”

Glenn Reynolds

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8 years 9 months ago #4498 by konza63
Thanks for the insights from your scouting friends, Peter. (Always insightful)

Everything rings true to me. I was just accounting for the possibility of a KU championship run in which Selden happens to hit the jackpot and go off. Admittedly, that's not a high-probability scenario to bet the house on, but if it did happen it would constitute some serious exposure that I thought could conceivably move him off the "high 2nd round" line to a "low 1st round line."

Maybe I'm wrong even about that scenario (if it were to come to fruition), but I recall those recent UK and UNC teams where the entire starting 5 (or close to it?) caught the benefit of momentum and League exposure after winning it all. (Not referring to our starting 5, but just the "wind tunnel" effect for a guy like Selden)

“With kindest regards to Dr. Forrest C. Allen, the father of basketball coaching, from the father of the game.”

1936 inscription on the portrait of Dr. Naismith, displayed above Phog Allen's office desk at KU.

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8 years 9 months ago #4506 by Senex68
If Selden replicated the UK game throughout the NCAAs he would almost definitely get 1st round consideration. It's clear he has the ability and the athleticism. His skills are still in question, and his mental discipline. For an NBA team to risk a guaranteed contract on a guy who is not going to be a superstar, and who is not a 5, they have to have absolute confidence that they will get everything the player has, each and every game. Right now nobody can predict what Selden will give us from game to game, and this is college. Would you wager anything on a 20 point and 5 assist game from him tomorrow night?

"When you have a ruling class that doesn’t believe in — or even much like — the fundamental values of the nations it rules, things tend to work out poorly.”

Glenn Reynolds

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8 years 9 months ago #4507 by konza63

Would you wager anything on a 20 point and 5 assist game from him tomorrow night?

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Definitely not. But it also wouldn't surprise me at all if he did. And therein lies the enigma that is Wayne Selden...

“With kindest regards to Dr. Forrest C. Allen, the father of basketball coaching, from the father of the game.”

1936 inscription on the portrait of Dr. Naismith, displayed above Phog Allen's office desk at KU.

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8 years 9 months ago #4515 by Senex68
I just recalled a comment made by Miles Simon during the KSU game about Selden's shooting form. He said that Selden wasn't using his legs on his long jumpers, which he found odd, and which he believes is the reason for Selden's inconsistency as far as the 3 is conce4rned during the latter part of the season. I find it strange that he still hasn't been able to shoot his 3s with good form and consistent form.

"When you have a ruling class that doesn’t believe in — or even much like — the fundamental values of the nations it rules, things tend to work out poorly.”

Glenn Reynolds

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